As revelations continue to pour from the Jan. 6 committee, Julia Ioffe and Tara Palmeri discuss the mounting pressure on Merrick Garland to indict the former president, how Trump’s donor anxiety might be the driving force behind his forthcoming ‘24 campaign announcement, why the Dems’ long-standing misconceptions about immigrant priorities have prevented them from developing a comprehensive electoral strategy, what a DeSantis presidency might look like, and which party has the deeper political bench.

Tara Palmeri: Julia, this may have been the most explosive week of January 6th testimony. We now know what many have long suspected—that Trump planned to have his supporters march toward the Capitol. Does this disclosure, following Cassidy Hutchinson’s testimony, move the needle forward on an indictment? I’ve previously reported that people close to Attorney General Merrick Garland think an indictment is a long shot, as he will have an adverse reaction to political committees demanding action from the D.O.J. But maybe the calculus is shifting.

Julia Ioffe: You know, I heard this last summer, too, that Garland was worried about balancing the need to punish such unprecedented acts and setting a precedent in which an incoming administration prosecutes its predecessors. But that was last summer, before Hutchinson, before these hearings, when we didn’t know nearly as much as we do now. It seems a much harder line to walk now that it’s increasingly clear just how unprecedented—and dangerous—Trump’s actions were, and how close we came to losing the entire system that Garland is trying to uphold.